DTP


 
Lively discussions on the graphic arts and publishing — in print or on the web


Go Back   Desktop Publishing Forum > General Discussions > Print Production & Automation

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-12-2006, 12:27 PM   #1
PeterArnel
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North of Swindon in the UK on the edge of the Cotswolds
Posts: 997
Default Coming to terms

Coated instead of machine varnished
Ram bundled
Picking
Backed up wrong
sorts
kinds
versions
PeterArnel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 05:24 AM   #2
donmcc
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Sarnia, Canada
Posts: 1,122
Default

Sorts can refer to hand type. When a typesetter ran out of a letter (perhaps the 'e') he was "out of sorts," which would make him rather grumpy until someone tore down another page so that he could continue.
donmcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 06:34 AM   #3
iamback
Member
 
iamback's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Amsterdam, NL
Posts: 4,894
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by donmcc
Sorts can refer to hand type. When a typesetter ran out of a letter (perhaps the 'e') he was "out of sorts," which would make him rather grumpy until someone tore down another page so that he could continue.
Thanks for that tidbit! I never learned where that expression came from, and it's nice to hear it comes from the printing industry.

   
__________________
Marjolein Katsma
Look through my eyes on Cultural Surfaces (soon!), My ArtFlakes shop and Flickr.
Occasionally I am also connecting online dots... and sometimes you can follow me on Marjolein's Travel Blog
iamback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 06:55 AM   #4
ktinkel
Founding Sysop
 
ktinkel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In Connecticut, on the Housatonic River near its mouth at Long Island Sound.
Posts: 11,189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterArnel
Coated instead of machine varnished
Ram bundled
Picking
Backed up wrong
sorts
kinds
versions
Coated vs varnish: Coated stock comes from the mill that way; varnishing is done on press. Look different, too.

Picking: Similar to hickey — small flaws in printing. Picking is caused by snippets of paper that are laid down with the ink and show up as voids on the pages when they fall off.

Backed up wrong: Printing on the second side is out of registration or worse (wrong way around, say).

Sort: Once referred to any piece of type, but with digital type it refers to non-standard characters (special symbols, pi characters)

Version: In printing, a different edition (one corrected or added to; one in English, another in German); binding (hardcover, trade paperback, say; classy with gold letters vs plain). More or less like the general sense of the word.

Kind: As far as printing goes, no idea. The way a good printer is to his customers? <g>

Ram bundled: All I can think of is livestock tied together; or maybe some extended computer memory?

   
__________________
[SIZE=2][COLOR=LemonChiffon]::[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ktinkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 06:58 AM   #5
ktinkel
Founding Sysop
 
ktinkel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In Connecticut, on the Housatonic River near its mouth at Long Island Sound.
Posts: 11,189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamback
Thanks for that tidbit! I never learned where that expression came from, and it's nice to hear it comes from the printing industry.
So did “mind your p’s and q’s”! In hand setting the two characters could be mistaken for each other.

Actually, in my (admittedly quite limited) experience, it might be more likely to confuse d with p or b with q — because a hand compositor is working upside down and backwards. But they are usually saved by the nick (a small cutout in the piece of type intended to indicate orientation).

   
__________________
[SIZE=2][COLOR=LemonChiffon]::[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ktinkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 08:04 AM   #6
Michael Rowley
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ipswich (the one in England)
Posts: 5,105
Default

KT:

Backed up wrong: Printing on the second side is out of registration or worse (wrong way around, say)

Does the expression have much sense now, given that raised type is hardly used?

   
__________________
Michael
Michael Rowley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 08:19 AM   #7
iamback
Member
 
iamback's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Amsterdam, NL
Posts: 4,894
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ktinkel
So did “mind your p’s and q’s”! In hand setting the two characters could be mistaken for each other.

Actually, in my (admittedly quite limited) experience, it might be more likely to confuse d with p or b with q — because a hand compositor is working upside down and backwards. But they are usually saved by the nick (a small cutout in the piece of type intended to indicate orientation).
It could just as easily refer to hand writing or handprinting (learners have trouble discerning the letter shapes - as do dyslexics). But it's far more obvious to me (having learned some typgraphy )*, while hand setting was one of the teaching tools!) than "out of sorts", mostly because I learned in Dutch and would not have known or recognized the term "sorts".

Sorts: the thingies you sort into the letter box for reuse?

)* Letterboxes (real or fake) these days are mostly used to display miniatures in. But to me (and my mum, who worked at a printer's for years) they have a bunch of other properties as well: a feel, a weight, even a smell! My metal typesetting ruler still sits next to me on my desk - lots of pleasant memories associated with it though I keep it there for practical uses.

   
__________________
Marjolein Katsma
Look through my eyes on Cultural Surfaces (soon!), My ArtFlakes shop and Flickr.
Occasionally I am also connecting online dots... and sometimes you can follow me on Marjolein's Travel Blog
iamback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 10:09 AM   #8
donmcc
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Sarnia, Canada
Posts: 1,122
Default

You must also remember that handset type is mirror image, which is going to make it harder to force yourself (as a young apprentice) to mind your p's and q's. The b and d would also be hard to differentiate, but the notch would keep you from mixing up p and d or q and b (although without it they would be a nightmare.
donmcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 10:26 AM   #9
ktinkel
Founding Sysop
 
ktinkel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In Connecticut, on the Housatonic River near its mouth at Long Island Sound.
Posts: 11,189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamback
Letterboxes . . .
We call them type cases (and use letterboxes, if we do, for mailboxes — the ones you drop your outgoing mail in.

I have a 24 or 30-case type chest downstairs (two ranks of 12 or 15 cases — forget which). Made of 2-inch oak, with an angled reading board on one side and with metal racks that support the cases. Also half a dozen fonts of Futura, and one or two other faces.

The chest is crude but gorgeous, a thing well made (probably about 1900) for a single task. The cases are redolent as you describe (and grimy, of course). I will have to do something with it all (including a small platen press), but have twice refused to sell any of it to people who want to turn the cases into some sort of wall ornament!

   
__________________
[SIZE=2][COLOR=LemonChiffon]::[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ktinkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2006, 10:28 AM   #10
ktinkel
Founding Sysop
 
ktinkel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In Connecticut, on the Housatonic River near its mouth at Long Island Sound.
Posts: 11,189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by donmcc
You must also remember that handset type is mirror image, which is going to make it harder to force yourself (as a young apprentice) to mind your p's and q's. The b and d would also be hard to differentiate, but the notch would keep you from mixing up p and d or q and b (although without it they would be a nightmare.
Perhaps I must remember, but I have had trouble with all four of those characters.

I admit I was never an adept typesetter, and all but one of my fonts are under 12 point, which made it harder. But regardless, I know some of us can confuse all of those characters, especially if they are in the wrong bin.

   
__________________
[SIZE=2][COLOR=LemonChiffon]::[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ktinkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Want to see what's coming? Wilma George The Corner Pub 7 10-22-2005 03:52 PM
Coming Up to Speed with Flash MX Clayton Web Site Building & Maintenance 2 06-03-2005 02:19 PM
New Epson printer coming! terrie Hardware & Gadgets 14 02-21-2005 04:00 PM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:31 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Contents copyright 2004–2014 Desktop Publishing Forum and its members.