DTP


 
Lively discussions on the graphic arts and publishing — in print or on the web


Go Back   Desktop Publishing Forum > General Discussions > Hardware & Gadgets

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-19-2008, 09:49 AM   #1
tuoni
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Printer and paper

I have been planning on starting a firm for quite some time now, for printing monochrome manga books (B6) and magazines (A4). Even though graphics and design is nothing new to me, "professional printing" is a bit new...as in what printer and paper I should use.

Having gone through Epson's web site, EPL-N2550 seems like a good choice for me, with up to 100,000 pages per month, and up to 17,000 pages per cartridge. I could probably use any common printing paper found in most computer/office supplies stores, however, I have been wondering whether something else would be better.

The coarse, greyish/dull white, presumably recycled paper used in manga books imported from japan looks very good. It does not seem heavier than the common printing paper, but is coarser, with tiny, dark spots here and there, unlike the common printing paper that is spotless, bright white. Naturally such a paper would also be better for printing on both sides, even if using half-tone pattern, a page with plenty of dark areas could still be a possible problem with common printing paper.

Anyway, I would be very appreciative of any suggestions ^_^
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2008, 12:44 PM   #2
annc
Sysop
 
annc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Subtropical Queensland, Australia, between the mountains and the Coral Sea
Posts: 4,436
Default

How many copies of each book and issue are you planning to print? Unless you're looking at very small print runs, you'll find it cheaper to find a commercial printer to do them for you. If you're planning to print the manga books yourself, I assume you have some sort of imposition program that can handle the back-to-front format?

You also have to allow for bleed and trimming, so the paper you buy will need to be oversize – not something you can get easily at office suppliers. And your printer will also have to be able to handle it.

Also, what do you plan to do about cover printing, binding and trimming? If your magazines are 80 pages or less, you can probably get away with saddle stitching, but the manga books, even though thin, should be perfect-bound.

The manga books I see are printed on very poor quality paper.

   
__________________
annc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2008, 11:36 PM   #3
tuoni
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
How many copies of each book and issue are you planning to print? Unless you're looking at very small print runs, you'll find it cheaper to find a commercial printer to do them for you.
At first I thought of using a commercial printer to do them for me, but became interested in doing it myself, being somewhat of a technology geek! This is a service for amateur mangaka (manga artists) and it would be based around a web store. So once an artist has received a minimum of orders, I print the book/magazine. Since this is amateur work it will probably be short works, and the maximum is 97 pages (including covers and info page, 94+3).

Quote:
If you're planning to print the manga books yourself, I assume you have some sort of imposition program that can handle the back-to-front format?
I will actually be using Photoshop to edit/print the books, and maybe Scribus for the magazines, although Photoshop would suffice for that as well.

Quote:
You also have to allow for bleed and trimming, so the paper you buy will need to be oversize – not something you can get easily at office suppliers. And your printer will also have to be able to handle it.
The EPL-N2550 has a 4 mm bleed edge, so that's no big deal, the content doesn't have to be all the way out to the edge.

Quote:
Also, what do you plan to do about cover printing, binding and trimming? If your magazines are 80 pages or less, you can probably get away with saddle stitching, but the manga books, even though thin, should be perfect-bound.
That would be problem, one that may force me to use a commercial printer, unless I find some equipment for doing it myself.

Quote:
The manga books I see are printed on very poor quality paper.
I guess there are differences between publishers...
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2008, 01:13 AM   #4
annc
Sysop
 
annc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Subtropical Queensland, Australia, between the mountains and the Coral Sea
Posts: 4,436
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuoni View Post
The EPL-N2550 has a 4 mm bleed edge, so that's no big deal, the content doesn't have to be all the way out to the edge.
Yes, but you need oversize paper to allow for trimming, and if you have more than 80 finished pages, you will need to go to perfect binding using signatures, as the creep will cause the margins to become smaller and smaller as you go to the centre spread, as well as causing difficulties with folding and saddle-stitching. Also, Photoshop doesn't do any sort of imposition, so you'll have to do the printer's spreads manually. How will you manage the multiple pages in Photoshop, or are you planning to use InDesign or Scribus for this?

Quote:
That would be problem, one that may force me to use a commercial printer, unless I find some equipment for doing it myself.
Hmm, I imagine the cost would make it difficult to make any money this way.

Quote:
I guess there are differences between publishers...
And printers...

I admire your enterprise, but do feel that you would be better off commissioning a print-on-demand shop to do the printing and production while you concentrate on the web design, selling and graphic design, which is probably as much as anyone can hope to do in any sort of commercial or semi-commercial operation.

   
__________________
annc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2008, 04:13 AM   #5
tuoni
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
I admire your enterprise, but do feel that you would be better off commissioning a print-on-demand shop to do the printing and production while you concentrate on the web design, selling and graphic design, which is probably as much as anyone can hope to do in any sort of commercial or semi-commercial operation.
I guess so, but I still want to learn, and even big companies were once dreams ^_^ I am also a great fan of DIY things, even if it would be cheaper with a commercial printing firm. With my own firm I could feel satisfied over actually making something, and by myself, something beautiful, the wonderful scent of paper, and fresh copies of some new book I haven't printed before. It's more than just a way to make money, it's an art form, and something you can be very proud of ^_^ Everything shouldn't be the large-scale commercial rape-and-pillage model ^~^;

Even if it never amounts to anything, I will still have learned something good and worthwhile!
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2008, 07:05 AM   #6
ktinkel
Founding Sysop
 
ktinkel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In Connecticut, on the Housatonic River near its mouth at Long Island Sound.
Posts: 11,189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuoni View Post
Even if it never amounts to anything, I will still have learned something good and worthwhile!
Then you should go for it. Who knows? You might end up buying an old letter press so you can print with ink (if you think paper smells nice, ink is heavenly!)

Let us know how it goes for you. It is an interesting project.

   
__________________
[SIZE=2][COLOR=LemonChiffon]::[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ktinkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2008, 07:02 AM   #7
Michael Rowley
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ipswich (the one in England)
Posts: 5,105
Default

Tuoni:

Quote:
what do you plan to do about cover printing, binding and trimming?
There are plenty of print-finishing firms here (UK), and I should expect there are in other countries. And from the sound of manga paper, which is described as having a smooth surface, it should be suitable for laser printers. Oversize A4 and A3 paper is available commercially in two standard sizes each, but I do not have any idea of the minimum quantity you would have to buy.

   
__________________
Michael
Michael Rowley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2008, 12:43 PM   #8
annc
Sysop
 
annc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Subtropical Queensland, Australia, between the mountains and the Coral Sea
Posts: 4,436
Default

Manga books are a type of comic book or graphic novel, Michael. They're printed from back to front...

   
__________________
annc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2008, 02:21 PM   #9
Michael Rowley
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ipswich (the one in England)
Posts: 5,105
Default

Ann:

Quote:
Manga books are a type of comic book or graphic novel, Michael. They're printed from back to front
I do, as it happens, I do know that Japanese books are printed from so the European verso is the Japanese recto; but what escapes me is how this affects printing or print-finishing. Admittedly, my daughter never brings home any comics when she’s in Japan (not even while she studied there).

   
__________________
Michael
Michael Rowley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2008, 09:14 AM   #10
dogmandouglas
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 96
Default

If you are using Photoshop to make and print the pages, why not use "Save As" and make pdfs of your pages. Once you have pdfs you will find that printing two separate pages through Acrobat reader as a spread much easier to handle.
dogmandouglas is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Red paper? iamback On Language & Literature 3 04-08-2008 09:19 AM
FSC Paper PeterArnel Print Design 3 11-20-2007 02:18 PM
Paper trimmers marlene Hardware & Gadgets 48 01-23-2007 07:22 PM
Names of Paper PeterArnel Print Production & Automation 8 05-14-2006 01:15 PM
AOL CD in our Sunday paper ktinkel The Corner Pub 16 10-10-2005 06:48 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:16 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Contents copyright 2004–2014 Desktop Publishing Forum and its members.