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Old 04-20-2006, 09:44 AM   #1
iamback
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Default If you believe in PageRanks...

...you might find Webmaster Eyes a handy site.

You can use their form to browse a site and see the page rank for each of the links on the page, or put the form on your own site (or on a local page, or so it only appears on your development server).

If you want to keep an eye on the PR of your own page(s), you can use their other PR tool to check a PR, and use their code to put on your own page. Unlike some other PR tools I've tried, it accepts a page URL, not just a site URL, so with a bit of server-side trickery you can have the PR of any page in your site with a single bit of code.

Note: Their code is ugly, using a layout table for the little form for instance, and particularly, there's a completely superfluous <noscript> section in both bits of code. But they don't say you can't change it - so adapt to make it valid, accessible, and just leave out the noscipt.

I just implemented the latter tool on my travel blog - just a single line in a single Smarty template - see the "tools and referrals" box in the sidebar (which badly needs reorganizing, I know...).

   
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Old 04-20-2006, 09:53 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamback
...you might find Webmaster Eyes a handy site.
Thanks for that — I did grab the code and will take a look at how you fixed it.

But now — since your title raises the question —can you tell us how useful Page Rank really is?

I know Kelvyn warns not to rely too heavily on it. Do you find that increasing your site’s page rank produces more (wanted) visitors?

Just curious.

   
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Old 04-20-2006, 11:47 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktinkel
Thanks for that — I did grab the code and will take a look at how you fixed it.
Basically two important things I did are:
  1. removed the noscript section (I suspect that's a remnant from older javascript-based code)
  2. removed the usual border="0" on the img tag since my stylesheet takes care of that anyway
A few more things:
  • I added a title attribute to the link and gave it the text of the proposed alt attribute for the image
  • replaced the alt tag by something that more accurately replaces the image (though it cannot be a complete replacement since I can't grab the actual rank number!)
  • wrapped a paragraph around it which (by means of my stylesheet) centers it within a sidebar box (apart from giving it some vertical space to breathe)
  • Used a variable I had already available in the Smarty template to build the current URL (and tested to check whether that actually worked with this service!)
Hmmm - when I write it out it's more than I thought, but I do these things routinely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ktinkel
But now — since your title raises the question —can you tell us how useful Page Rank really is?
There's no doubt it has an influence on the "visibility" of your pages - to an extent. By how much, is anybody's guess I think. But I'm keeping an eye on it anyway since for a long time I got very little traffic to my blog from Google, with traffic from MSN far surpassing it. Now, that seems to be changing - though I don't see clear differences in PR. More puzzling even is that it used to be that pages "deeper" in your site (count the number of /s in your URL) would directly influence PR but that seems to be no longer the case. I have "SE-friendly" URLs but that can result in extra slashes (virtual directories) - in spite of that, I've found that some inner pages have higher PR than the main website URL. It's not incoming links as far I can determine...

I have a few other of these thingies installed, but only this one is publicly viewable (because it's nicely designed and I provide other statistics, so why not?). One of them also reports indexed pages and backlinks - the author of that tool doesn't seem to react to email though, so I don't want to display it publicly). The puzzling thing here is that those figures seem to fluctuate rather wildly, jumping from 13,500 indexed pages to less than 700 (huh?).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ktinkel
I know Kelvyn warns not to rely too heavily on it. Do you find that increasing your site’s page rank produces more (wanted) visitors?
I'm definitely not relying on it but do attempt to increase PR and otherwise "visibility". How much what helps is often not clear, and what helps with MSN may not help with Google... And some SEO features are really difficult to control on a totally dynamic blog-like site like mine - for instance I have meta keywords and descriptions but they are completely generated dynamically from page content.

   
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Old 04-20-2006, 12:25 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamback
There's no doubt it has an influence on the "visibility" of your pages - to an extent. By how much, is anybody's guess I think. But I'm keeping an eye on it anyway . . .
I keep an eye on it as well, but blindly.

I have noticed that we lost a point on both the home page and our index page recently, with no particular changes in activity. So it does no harm to look, I figure.

   
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Old 04-20-2006, 03:21 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktinkel
I have noticed that we lost a point on both the home page and our index page recently, with no particular changes in activity. So it does no harm to look, I figure.
PR is changing at the moment; the algorithm is being referred to as "Popularity Rank" rather then "Page Rank" and seems to relate to not only the type of backlinks and the PR of the page carrying that link, but also how much they are used. Good content pages within a site will always attract good links and plenty of clickthru's, so that an internal page can have a higher PR than the same site's homepage.

   
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Old 04-21-2006, 12:09 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvyn
PR is changing at the moment; the algorithm is being referred to as "Popularity Rank" rather then "Page Rank" and seems to relate to not only the type of backlinks and the PR of the page carrying that link, but also how much they are used. Good content pages within a site will always attract good links and plenty of clickthru's, so that an internal page can have a higher PR than the same site's homepage.
Ah, that fits with one of my tentative observations: that pages that are actually accessed a lot tend to get a higher PR: For some reason people lin Turkey seem to search a lot for placenames in Turkey and the ones I talk about can be found with their official, Turkish spelling (although the URL uses a "transliterated" version of the place name).

See for instance:
(PR 4) http://blog.iamback.com/day/2004-05-18/i/Shanliurfa
(PR 5) http://blog.iamback.com/place/Shanliurfa/tr

The same seems to be happening with places in Iran (where I use a semi-official transliteration with diacriticals - there is no official one!):
(PR 4) http://blog.iamback.com/day/2004-05-31/i/Kashan
(PR 5) http://blog.iamback.com/place/Kashan/ir

If you look at the ClustrMaps map (click through from the little map in the side bar) you can see I am indeed gettng quite a few hits from Turkey and Iran.

Hmmm - I wonder whether adding official Pinyin spelling of Chinese places would help here... or even actual Chinese spelling

Then again, if many pages aren't indexed in the first place, there won't be any clickthroughs to count. OTH, I found out that a site that I actually had removed from Google a few years ago (strictly beta, and shelved for the moment) still has a PR (2), which is weird, to say the least.

   
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Old 04-23-2006, 05:16 AM   #7
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Default Does it work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ktinkel
Thanks for that — I did grab the code and will take a look at how you fixed it.

But now — since your title raises the question —can you tell us how useful Page Rank really is?

I know Kelvyn warns not to rely too heavily on it. Do you find that increasing your site’s page rank produces more (wanted) visitors?

Just curious.
Does this tool actually work? I compared the page ranks I see in the Google bar of MSIE with the page ranks provided by this tool, and I have my doubts.

The civic association web site home page has a rank of 4, but none of the links have anything other than 0, according to the tool, but looking at the ranking directly, some of the secondary pages have a rank of 4 or 3, and only the newest are ranked 0.

Admittedly, I did a rather hasty check. Please check it out for yourself.
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Old 04-23-2006, 06:10 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dthomsen8
Does this tool actually work? I compared the page ranks I see in the Google bar of MSIE with the page ranks provided by this tool, and I have my doubts.

The civic association web site home page has a rank of 4, but none of the links have anything other than 0, according to the tool, but looking at the ranking directly, some of the secondary pages have a rank of 4 or 3, and only the newest are ranked 0.
Interesting. I haven’t installed this thing anywhere, but it will be interesting to hear how others find it compared to the Google PageRank toolbar thingie.

   
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Old 04-23-2006, 08:31 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dthomsen8
Does this tool actually work? I compared the page ranks I see in the Google bar of MSIE with the page ranks provided by this tool, and I have my doubts.

The civic association web site home page has a rank of 4, but none of the links have anything other than 0, according to the tool, but looking at the ranking directly, some of the secondary pages have a rank of 4 or 3, and only the newest are ranked 0.
I didn't note any differences - but it could depend on which Google server is being queried. Differences are possible. I saw a page where you could give a URL and it would check a whole list of Google servers - with varying results, but mostly either the same page rank the toolbar gives OR zero.

Do you see any zeros in my site's pages?

   
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