Front Page, How Do I Hate Thee ...

[Steve Rindsberg]

It's an odd thing. Some people seem to get along fine with MS Front Page. Sure, the HTML may be ugly but let's not go there.

I can't quite put my finger on why, but by turns it enrages or mystifies me.
No, that's not quite true. The two don't share and share alike. It enrages far more than it mystifies.

Perhaps it's a combination of weirdness between it and the unix-based ISP I use. For example, I've got a separate site with them that has FP extensions enabled. This just so I could learn more about FP. Changed the password on the account for various reasons and that works fine but apparently that doesn't "take" for the FP end of things. It still insists on the old password.

Feh.

And I'm not allowed to create subwebs. And it doesn't appear to permit alotting permissions by user category.

Is this normal or is it peculiar to my ISP?

Or maybe I'm looking for too much? My idea was this: I work with a couple of nonprofits. Sometimes they have a real web designer, sometimes somebody who's at least competent with FP and can do the web work. I'm trying to host the files is all. By setting up a separate site I was hoping to be able to turn over the password to <whomever> and let them do updates rather than having them send me the changed files and letting me send them up (a bigger PITA than you'd believe once you toss in random filename changes that break links, upper/lowercase vagaries and the rest).

I was further hoping that I could set up various directories, each accessible as a separate site (all with a shared password if need be ... and with the understanding that if the password gets out and stuff starts to go awry, I shut everybody down, end of story.)

While the immediate need is met (one site, one user with FP able to update it) the other ideas seem to have run into a brick wall.

Feh.

[donmcc]

I've taught FrontPage. I like it about as well as you do. It is designed to be run in a MS world, with all the security leaks that means. You might want to look into a service provider who runs a separate box using MS software, which tends to work better than a Unix box with the extensions.

A better plan is to wean your customers off FP and into Dreamweaver, which is still fairly user friendly and a lot more powerful. It has the ability for you to lock off design parts of pages, and leave editable areas where the customer can make regular changes.

I've not played with the Adobe option (which may soon be Dreamweaver, after the merger) of GoLive, but I think it is a step or two above FrontPage as well.

Don McCahill

[ktinkel]

Feh.Sounds as if you should be at one of the hosts I use, softcomca.com. They are just starting add Linux hosting, but are in their deep hearts seriously Windows. (They are also a very reliable and obliging host; like others, I was referred there by Jim Eaves.)

[LoisWakeman]

Steve, fortunately I don't have to use FP any more, but I understand that it is a lot more restricted on UNIX than NT: in the latter case, it can interface easily with the Windows user setup. If you must use it, go to a specialist FP/Win host: try www.outfront.net for some ideas and support.

But I would, instead, very strongly recommend Macromedia Contribute, which works very well with Dreamweaver and allows you to specify which bits of the page/which pages each user or group of users are allowed to edit. It is not very expensive, and has worked well for me with naive clients.

[Steve Rindsberg]

Weaning 'em off FP isn't a starter, I'm afraid, but it sounds as though you're confirming my suspicion that Unix+FPExtensions isn't as happy a combination as IISP on a Windows server. That part's under my control. This is as much about my learning a bit of FP as anything and if coping with it and incomplete support under Unix is going to lead to more frustration, then a new ISP for this portion of the deal is in order.

Thanks!

[Steve Rindsberg]

KT,

Thanks ... I've heard nothing but good about softcomca.com and was going to ask if they were Windows based or *nix.

I'll give 'em a look.

[Steve Rindsberg]

Hi Lois,

Another confirmation ... thanks. I'm going to see if I can scare up an inexpensive Win-based host. Unfortunately, it's not in the cards for me to specify the software.

sigh

[Steve Rindsberg]

Well, Don and Lois, ya nailed it. I set up a site at softcomca.com (thanks KT) under a windows server (and they throw in a free Linux account too, can you beat that?). I still dislike Front Page but managing the site with it is nowhere near the crazy-making experience it was. In not a whole lot of time I was able to suck down the site from the current URL into FP and squirt it back up to the new domain. tobuta.com for anyone who's curious. Yep, I know bits of the site are still busted. That'll get fixed. As to the rest, I'm just the tame geek who makes it go, nothing to do with making it pretty. ;-)

Thanks all, for the on-the-money advice.

[LoisWakeman]

Steve - you are more than welcome! Usually free advice is worth what you pay - but here, you obviously get a quality product <G>

[donmcc]

Great ... where do I send the bill?

<Grin>

[ktinkel]

Steve - you are more than welcome!Great ... where do I send the bill?Hmmmm. Interesting contrast here between England (Lois) and Canada (Don). Have to ponder on the meaning of all this!

<g>

[Steve Rindsberg]

No problem KT. Don can send the bill for my free advice to Lois.
She can send the check to you.
Everybody's covered.

[donmcc]

Nothing national about it. I'm just a greedy bast***.

Don

[LoisWakeman]

Great ... where do I send the bill?Well, there's a needy duck on the village pond who could proably do with a spare <G>

[ktinkel]

Nothing national about it. I'm just a greedy bast***.
Ahhh. I see. Well, nothing venture, nothing gain! <g>