special ACSII characters

[Andy_G]

I'm trying to find the special ACSII character for representation of
'Publisher' or 'Published'. Similar to © but with a 'p'.

I've scoured the net trying to find references to it, or even find it used
on a page somewhere, but no luck.
The Windows keycaps/character map application doesn't seem to have it in
any of the font sets I have available, neither does the Mac.

I'm at a loss, I hope someone here can help!

/A

[Shane Stanley]

It's Unicode name is "Sound recording copyright", and it's codepoint is 2117. You can find it in Apple Symbol, Lucida Grande and MS Gothic.

Shane

[ktinkel]

I'm trying to find the special ACSII character for representation of
'Publisher' or 'Published'. Similar to © but with a 'p'.In addition to the fonts Shane mentions, it is (oddly enough) in Microsoft’s Webdings (but not in any of the Wingdings that I could discover).

You should probably test the print quality if you use Webdings, though. It has been optimized for reading onscreen. It may be fine, but …

[Robin Springall]

Ah the circled C and P problem again! Webdings works fine, but it's sans-serif: be sure to use a sans version of the circled C as well, or they'll look odd together. Also, check that the strokes of the two symbols have similar weights.

Being a bloke, I can P in a circle but I can't C in a circle!

[Michael Rowley]

KT:

Code 2117 is also in a font called 'Verdana Ref' (a Microsoft font). The Webdings glyphs are not in any of the usual Unicode subranges.

[Michael Rowley]

Robin:

Swank!

[ktinkel]

Being a bloke, I can P in a circle but I can't C in a circle!Yeah, yeah, yeah — and you can reproduce your company trademark in the snow. In yellow.

Big deal! <g>

[Andy_G]

Yup, I found it eventually in Webdings but finding a suitable match in other fonts for weight etc could be tricky.

Why isn't this commonly found in other, more obvious, font families then the ones mentioned so far?
I would have thought that it would get more use than some of the characters that are usually present!

[Andy_G]

"Code 2117 is also in a font called 'Verdana Ref' (a Microsoft font)."


which www.linotype.com (http://www.linotype.com/) doesn't seem to know exists....is this a free font then?? where can I get it?

It appears (according to http://home.tampabay.rr.com/bmerkey/examples/fonts-in-MS-products.htm) to be be available only in MS Office 2000 Premium.
Which I don't have access to.

[ktinkel]

Why isn't this commonly found in other, more obvious, font families then the ones mentioned so far?

I would have thought that it would get more use than some of the characters that are usually present!Most of our fonts descend from metal or photo type, and were developed before the common use of circle-p.

(Most commercial fonts have been updated to include the euro symbol, however.)

[Michael Rowley]

Andy:

available only in MS Office 2000 Premium

Oh, that's where I got it—I had no idea where it came from, what it's for. or how it differs from Verdana.

[Michael Rowley]

KT:

developed before the common use of circle-p

I didn't know that it was common, or what its purpose is. A piece of music is copyright (if the copyright hasn't expired), so why isn't the ordinary copyright sign used? Is it something purely US-American?

[ktinkel]

I didn't know that it was common, or what its purpose is. A piece of music is copyright (if the copyright hasn't expired), so why isn't the ordinary copyright sign used? Is it something purely US-American?No — it is also in use in the U.K. (and, I expect, all the Berne countries).

Regular copyright applies to things in visual form; the sound recording copyright symbol applies to things which are heard. I do not know when the circle-P symbol came into use, but I associate it with music CDs. (It may have been on LPs too, but I never noticed it there.)

This is from the U.S. Copyright Office explanation (http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html) (but you can probably find it in your local sources as well):
The "C in a circle" notice is used only on "visually perceptible copies." Certain kinds of works--for example, musical, dramatic, and literary works--may be fixed not in "copies" but by means of sound in an audio recording. Since audio recordings such as audio tapes and phonograph disks are "phonorecords" and not "copies," the "C in a circle" notice is not used to indicate protection of the underlying musical, dramatic, or literary work that is recorded.
After a lot more words, it then says that phonorecords should use the P in a circle instead of the C.

I usually see both symbols used. I suspect the standard © applies to the written material that is being performed since, after all, lyrics and sheet music are entitled to copyright on their own. And that the P symbol relates to the specific performance. But I do not actually know.

[Michael Rowley]

KT:

Thank you for the explanation. I found this:

'What copyright exists in music?
There are principally 2 types of copyright to consider when we talk about music copyright.


The traditional ©, ‘C in a circle’ copyright, applies to the composition, musical score, lyrics, as well as any artwork or cover designs, as all of these are individually subject to copyright in their own rights, (though when you register, you can include them all in a single registration provided they have the same copyright owner(s)).
The second type of copryright applies to the sound recording itself, and is signified by the ‘P in a circle’ http://copyrightservice.co.uk/_i/phonogram.jpg.'
I just hadn't kept up to date. It's relatively recently that the law of copyright changed, so that the 'P' sign would not be found in any but fairly recent fonts.

[Ian Petersen]

It may have been on LPs too, but I never noticed it there.It was in use on vinyl LPs from at least the mid 70s. In fact I always used to think it stood for 'pressed', as in 'the LP was first pressed in 1973'.

[Michael Rowley]

Ian:

The P stands for 'phonogram'—not a word anyone would think of first. The P sign is to give warning and protection under the UCC (not Berne):

'Phonogram rights in sound recordings http://copyrightservice.co.uk/_i/phonogram.jpg
Sound recordings have a right separate from the underlying musical composition, and a sound recordings should carry a phonogram copyright notice (denoted by the P in a circle) for the recording itself. The standard © notice should also be used, but in the case of sound recordings this is used to protect the cover design, lyric sheets or other printed material included with the sound recording.

In our example, this would give the appearance of the notice as Copyright © 2004 Bobby Smith, http://copyrightservice.co.uk/_i/phonogram.jpg 2004 Bobby Smith.

Tip: On most computers the http://copyrightservice.co.uk/_i/phonogram.jpg symbol can be found within the Webdings font.

The information you have read so far gives you the minimum that both the Universal Copyright Convention and the UK Copyright Service suggest you include in your copyright notice.'

I can't find out when the P-sign was introduced. (Nor why it appears so big!)