Changes to the Forum

[donmcc]

I wonder what others think of the chagnes that are being made to the forums (or is it fora ... oops, have to post that under words).

I like it, particularly that there are now three web based sections. The subheadings are nice as well.

Good work to those involved.

Don McCahill

[Anne Wright]

Don, I really like the new categories for web development since that is really more what I am interested in rather than publishing.
But I wonder if it is possible to set up forum subcategories to group the different areas of interest? I know they do it over in the Pets Forums (http://www.thepetsforums.com/forums/index.php?), which are also on vBulletin.
Anne

[ktinkel]

But I wonder if it is possible to set up forum subcategories to group the different areas of interest? I know they do it over in the Pets Forums (http://www.thepetsforums.com/forums/index.php?), which are also on vBulletin.It is possible. But we decided not to do that to avoid duplication of topics of relevance to both sorts of endeavor (including Photos, Scans; /Drawing, Béziers; All About Fonts; and Running Your Business), not to mention the general sections (Words and The Corner Pub).

Give this a try for a while and then let us know what you think.

[don Arnoldy]

But I wonder if it is possible to set up forum subcategories to group the different areas of interest?I belong to several forums that make heavy use of subcategories and it annoys the bejeezus out of me--I find the navagation tedious--it takes three clicks(with waiting for new pages) to get anywhere.

[LoisWakeman]

Don - the girls (and boys) in the back room have done a great job, haven't they? I think all us INETPUB refugees will feel very welcome here. I might send emails to some old CIS aquaintances and ask them to drop by too. (But not all - this is a nice quiet place!)

[Daudio]

I belong to several forums that make heavy use of subcategories and it annoys the bejeezus out of me
It doesn't have to. I assume that you are annoyed because you have to click and wait to navigate to the subcatagories.

Instead have all the catagories on the same page, but arranged heirarchaly, like <h1>, <h2>, <p>.

Here is an example (http://www.snarkish.com/cgi-bin/forums/ikonboard.cgi?).

Dave

[don Arnoldy]

Here is an example.Snarkish is not too bad..two levels deep, like here. vBulletin is capable of nesting subforums at least two additional level--and those are what make me crazy.

[dthomsen8]

It seems to me that Latin plurals are slowly fading away in English usage. Forums, not fora is generally accepted.

[donmcc]

It seems to me that Latin plurals are slowly fading away in English usage. Forums, not fora is generally accepted.

I hope so. I made the comment in jest. (I'm not even sure that fora is correct. I think my Latin mark in Grade 10 was 27% or something of the sort.)

Don McCahill

[donmcc]

Don - the girls (and boys) in the back room have done a great job, haven't they?

They have, haven't they?

[Anne Wright]

Don, Actually I was thinking of a few simple divisions - fewer than in your example. But maybe once the various subject areas settle down to a final version, all I may want is a slightly different order. Right now the order of the different sections seems disjointed. Having run a couple of very simple forums, I understand how this can happen, but it'd be more convenient if the web discussion, the graphics and the publishing areas were grouped together. And a subsection is not required for that.
Anne

[ktinkel]

Right now the order of the different sections seems disjointed. Having run a couple of very simple forums, I understand how this can happen, but it'd be more convenient if the web discussion, the graphics and the publishing areas were grouped together.We plan to leave this arrangement for the time being to see how it works out. Honest: Ann, Elyse, and I gave a lot of thought to the topics and their order, and we hope the logic becomes clearer with use.

But if not, have no fear <g> — at some point in the future we can certainly revise the order, possibly use sections, and change, add, or omit topics. As I am sure you appreciate, there is no perfect arrangement that will suit everyone. Alas.

[donmcc]

Things can change through evolution, or revolution. I prefer the former.

Keep up the good work.

Don McCahill

[ktinkel]

Things can change through evolution, or revolution. I prefer the former.

Keep up the good work.Thanks, Don. As Ben Stein likes to say, “We shall do our best!” <g>

[Andrew B.]

The order right now is how it might be arranged if these were chapters in a book. The method you suggest is interesting because it breaks out the graphic areas (which overlap web and dtp) as their own grouping. So I'll keep this in mind for the next review of the arrangement.

[Anne Wright]

Kathleen, You know, I realized after I had written my previous message that it is arranged in a logical way - design for print and for web, graphics, production for print and for web, etc.
Don't worry, if the order continues to bother me now that I see your logic, I'll let you know ;-D
Anne

[annc]

Don, Actually I was thinking of a few simple divisions - fewer than in your example. As Kathleen says, she, Elyse and I spent a lot of time on the new forum organisation, and discovered that the amount of overlap precluded dividing it up. Of course, the amount of overlap we discovered is actually confirmation that INETPUB is a good fit with us, and we really hope that everyone in each group manages to find the topics they are interested in.

The Pets divisions are logical and easy to follow, but there's little or no overlap there.

[dacoyle]

It is possible. But we decided not to do that to avoid duplication of topics of relevance to both sorts of endeavor (including Photos, Scans; /Drawing, Béziers; All About Fonts; and Running Your Business), not to mention the general sections (Words and The Corner Pub).

Give this a try for a while and then let us know what you think.

Kathleen,

Anne has a valid point, especially for visitors like me who are unlikely to go to any non-web sections. Jumping back and forth isn't as user friendly as well organized sections. I totally agree on the overlap, but a properly constructed topic grouping is as important as valid code.

I'd have to give it some thought to pick logical groups, but your idea of leaving it for now is best. Give us a chance to work with it awhile and you'll get better feedback. Main problem I'm having for now is the three web areas not being together... but it's still new.

[ktinkel]

I'd have to give it some thought to pick logical groups, but your idea of leaving it for now is best. Give us a chance to work with it awhile and you'll get better feedback. Main problem I'm having for now is the three web areas not being together... but it's still new.We’ll see how it goes. Our notion was to integrate the two types of publishing, not segregate them, but if this arrangement doesn’t work for the long haul, we will consider a different one.

Meanwhile you might find something useful in sections not actually labeled “web” — never can tell! <g>

[Anne Wright]

Ann, I'm now getting more used to it - but aren't the changes continuing?
I think the fit here is great - and of course many of the talented people are the same in both groups.
It is looking good!
Anne

[Anne Wright]

Meanwhile you might find something useful in sections not actually labeled “web” — never can tell!
Well, that is certainly true for me! I'm not really into desktop publishing, though I have done some brochures for my business. I joined when my husband got a job at Kinko's since he kept asking me questions about publishing stuff. And much of what I have learned in DTP has been used to help him. But I have learned things that I have applied to my web stuff, too.
Besides the people in DTP are great and fun to hang out with!
Anne

[ktinkel]

Besides the people in DTP are great and fun to hang out with!Aw, gee. (Same to you!)

[annc]

Ann, I'm now getting more used to it - but aren't the changes continuing?
I think the fit here is great - and of course many of the talented people are the same in both groups.
It is looking good!Thanks, Anne. We do try not to set things in concrete around here, so there will certainly be changes and refinements here necessary.

[Andrew B.]

Anne, have you tried reading the forum using standard vBulletin automated methods. It took me awhile to get used to them, but they are faster and easier than looking over the forum list for where I want to read, and quicker at getting to topics of primary interest. At least, for me they are.

[dacoyle]

We’ll see how it goes. Our notion was to integrate the two types of publishing, not segregate them, but if this arrangement doesn’t work for the long haul, we will consider a different one.

Meanwhile you might find something useful in sections not actually labeled “web” — never can tell! <g>

Kathleen,

Unless I start my own business, doubtful. And I absolutely do not want to offend any of the wonderful people that have given INETPUB a refuge. I just have no personal use for most DTP topics because I do online for a living. I gave up print over 7 years ago when I finally gave up and addmitted to myself that no matter how great my tech manuals were, no one read them. Ditto for online Help; but people do read my web sites. ;>

One advantage of the influx of web folk is we will be able to give you advice on your own site! And I'm going to guess your group will be MUCH more willing to listen than CS was, since CS basically ignored or did the opposite of any advice offered from INETPUB.

I do want to study it for awhile though and maybe get my bosses opinion. Topic structure is a new study area for me. My main area of expertise is usability (not CSS; that's newer to me; only about a year, hard core).

If I had the time, I would have set up my own forum... but my preferred host company only offers phpBB ($16/mo hosting) and I've heard too much about vBulletin being better, i.e., offering threads and more mods. So since I'm not ready to tackle anything on my own, I just plan to blend in here for now or a few years. <g>

If I were a millionaire with time on my hands, I'd start my own web forum, but then also a portal site for all the PHP former CS forums. Recreate the former expertise pool... I think it could be possible, but I just don't have the resources to try to start it.

Imagine if CS hadn't been so short sighted (AOL for that matter to) and accepted the fact the Internet changed the game... I hear AOL is trying to shift to more web-based now. If we had had PHP bbs 5 years ago, CS could have just shifted then instead of selling out to AOL and killing a vibrant community.

Hindsight is 20 20...

[dacoyle]

Anne, have you tried reading the forum using standard vBulletin automated methods. It took me awhile to get used to them, but they are faster and easier than looking over the forum list for where I want to read, and quicker at getting to topics of primary interest. At least, for me they are.

What are the standard automated methods? I often miss replies when threads start getting past 20 replies or so...

I still miss CSNAV.

Dennis

[Andrew B.]

What are the standard automated methods? I often miss replies when threads start getting past 20 replies or so...Try starting with this one (http://www.desktoppublishingforum.com/bb/showthread.php?t=105). Except when I wrote that, I don't think I mentioned ending the session by using "Mark Forums Read." I've added that to my routine.

[Anne Wright]

Ann, It is very nice that things here can change as needed without major upheavals! I am just so pleased that two of the most useful and friendly forums I visit are now together with better forum software than in places left unnamed.

This is great!
Anne

[Anne Wright]

Andrew, I tried some of those methods back when you suggested them and I tried using the New Messages link in the main menu. But for me, working down the list of forum sections works best. For one thing, using some of the automated methods makes it harder to keep track of what section the message was posted in which can change the context somewhat. I like to keep track of sections, just a preference of mine.
Anne

[Daudio]

Being new to this forum, I have been using the 'New Posts' item in the menu. It is working pretty well for me after catching up a bit.

I don't have to 'Mark as Read', since the software (cookies ?) keeps track very well as best as I can see, and better then other furums I use. the only thing I would like is to have the web sections grouped together, but that is not that big a deal, and probably hard to implement.

So far I like the Linear mode and have new posts on top. We'll see how well this method works down the road...

Dave

[terrie]

>>daudio: So far I like the Linear mode and have new posts on top.

I use linear oldest first.

When I come into the forum, I Get Posts > New Posts

From the new posts list, I right click/open new window on the down arrow icon of the first thread in the list which positions me to the first new post for that thread since my last visit. I read through the thread (replying too) and then close that window which takes me back to my master new posts list and I again right click/open new window on the down arrow icon of the next new post in the list...

When I've read all the new posts, then I click on Get Posts > New Posts again to see if there are any additional new posts. If not, then I close this master new posts window leaving the forum...

Terrie

[Daudio]

I right click/open new window on the down arrow icon of the first thread in the list which positions me to the first new post for that thread since my last visit.

Ah, so thats what that little box just to the left of the thread name is for !

I'll have to try it out. Thanks...

[Andrew B.]

Ah, so thats what that little box just to the left of the thread name is for !Yes, it takes some time to discover all the helpful features. The "V" in the box is supposed to be an arrowhead pointing down, as if pointing to the first new message in the thread. Interestingly, the first new message in the thread might be below another new message in the thread, as far as the tree display goes, because of the way thread trees work. But in linear, it should be above other new messages.

BTW, the way I become familiar with a lot of this was via mouseover help. For example, in the "get new" list you will see a member name on every topic. Hoover the mouse pointer over the arrowhead that is to the right of the name, and the mouseover help will tell you where it takes you.

[terrie]

>>daudio: Ah, so thats what that little box just to the left of the thread name is for !

LOL!!! Took me a while to find it too...very handy...

Terrie

[donmcc]

Thanks for the tip. That is a new one to me.

Don McCahill